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| Guest |
 Posted: Fri Oct 29, 2010 6:32 am |
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We discussed a bit about packaging Erlang at the Erlang Factory in
London this year.
One very interesting suggestion was to improve the separation of the
runtime environment from the development environment.
vds
On Thu, 2010-10-28 at 17:27 +0400, Max Lapshin wrote:
> Ubuntu package is frozen at R13B04 and Debian on R13. Also, it would
> be very cool to see builds for 9.10, 10.04 and lenny.
> Maybe maintainer is here and he just needs help with building it?
>
> Or the easiest way for me is to make debian folder for builds for
> exact platforms, which must be stored near erlyvideo?
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> erlang-questions (at) erlang.org mailing list.
> See http://www.erlang.org/faq.html
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| maxlapshin |
| Posted: Fri Oct 29, 2010 6:47 am |
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On Thu, Oct 28, 2010 at 6:05 PM, Vincenzo Di Somma
<vincenzo.di.somma@canonical.com> wrote:
> We discussed a bit about packaging Erlang at the Erlang Factory in
> London this year.
> One very interesting suggestion was to improve the separation of the
> runtime environment from the development environment.
>
Maybe it is a good idea to split into erlang and erlang-dev, maybe
not, but when there are no fresh packages for months and it still
requires some knowledge hidden inside one person to build a package,
everything ends in ./configure && make && make install on production
server.
I tried to build R14B for squeeze, but failed: too complex build setup
required. If situation doesn't change, I will have to refuse from
building debian package because of no erlang in debian or ubuntu.
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| maxlapshin |
| Posted: Fri Oct 29, 2010 7:07 am |
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Ubuntu package is frozen at R13B04 and Debian on R13. Also, it would
be very cool to see builds for 9.10, 10.04 and lenny.
Maybe maintainer is here and he just needs help with building it?
Or the easiest way for me is to make debian folder for builds for
exact platforms, which must be stored near erlyvideo?
________________________________________________________________
erlang-questions (at) erlang.org mailing list.
See http://www.erlang.org/faq.html
To unsubscribe; mailto:erlang-questions-unsubscribe@erlang.org
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| siv |
| Posted: Fri Oct 29, 2010 8:53 am |
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| Guest |
| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 8:27 pm |
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The next Ubuntu release, 11.04, will be out on April 2011 and unless
something changes it will probably ship the same version that has been
shipped so far.
I haven't worked on the .deb packages myself but I've heard it's a quite
complicated by the big number of dependencies the erlang tarball has.
I'm under the impression that splitting the runtime and the development
environment will make the packaging and the maintenance of the packages
a lot easier.
Thanks,
vds
On Fri, 2010-10-29 at 10:51 +0200, Alessandro Sivieri wrote:
> We could try to backport packages from the next Ubuntu release, assuming
> that it will have the R14B release; the first alpha of 11.04 should come out
> in a few days, if I remember correctly...
>
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| Guest |
| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 8:30 pm |
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On Thu, 2010-10-28 at 11:48 -0700, Anthony Molinaro wrote:
> It's not debian, but for the last few versions of erlang, I've been updating
> the EPEL spec file and patches. The nice thing is that several patches
> became unnecessary between R12 and R13, most of the rest disappeared with
> R14 (the one remaining patch just disables the formating of man pages).
> So right now I have a pretty vanilla setup, very simple .spec and a single
> patch (you can build the whole thing with rpmbuild -ba erlang.spec), I
> attached the spec and patch (both derived from those included in the EPEL
> SRPM of R12).
>
> It may be that its easier to package when you have a single package for
> the whole thing?
I think it will make things much worse.
> Anyway, maybe it will help in packaging for debian/ubuntu, to see an
> rpm example?
If it's one big huge rmp, nope it's not going to help. 
Thanks,
vds
> On Thu, Oct 28, 2010 at 06:17:38PM +0400, Max Lapshin wrote:
> > On Thu, Oct 28, 2010 at 6:05 PM, Vincenzo Di Somma
> > <vincenzo.di.somma@canonical.com> wrote:
> > > We discussed a bit about packaging Erlang at the Erlang Factory in
> > > London this year.
> > > One very interesting suggestion was to improve the separation of the
> > > runtime environment from the development environment.
> > >
> >
> > Maybe it is a good idea to split into erlang and erlang-dev, maybe
> > not, but when there are no fresh packages for months and it still
> > requires some knowledge hidden inside one person to build a package,
> > everything ends in ./configure && make && make install on production
> > server.
> >
> > I tried to build R14B for squeeze, but failed: too complex build setup
> > required. If situation doesn't change, I will have to refuse from
> > building debian package because of no erlang in debian or ubuntu.
> >
> > ________________________________________________________________
> > erlang-questions (at) erlang.org mailing list.
> > See http://www.erlang.org/faq.html
> > To unsubscribe; mailto:erlang-questions-unsubscribe@erlang.org
> >
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> erlang-questions (at) erlang.org mailing list.
> See http://www.erlang.org/faq.html
> To unsubscribe; mailto:erlang-questions-unsubscribe@erlang.org
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| maxlapshin |
| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 8:35 pm |
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Frankly speaking, I'm going to create monolitic packages (only one
erlang package) for two versions of debian and ubuntu. Just for those,
who is not going to wait two years for official build.
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| Guest |
| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 9:11 pm |
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I think monolithic is the way to go. OTP is released all as one thing so I don't see how splitting it would help you over time, maintenance would be a pain. With a monolithic package its very minimal to update, R14B took me about an hour to package and push to our yum repo.
-Anthony
On Oct 30, 2010, at 1:33 PM, Max Lapshin <max.lapshin@gmail.com> wrote:
> Frankly speaking, I'm going to create monolitic packages (only one
> erlang package) for two versions of debian and ubuntu. Just for those,
> who is not going to wait two years for official build.
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> erlang-questions (at) erlang.org mailing list.
> See http://www.erlang.org/faq.html
> To unsubscribe; mailto:erlang-questions-unsubscribe@erlang.org
>
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| maxlapshin |
| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 9:19 pm |
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On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 1:07 AM, Anthony Molinaro
<anthonym@alumni.caltech.edu> wrote:
> I think monolithic is the way to go. OTP is released all as one thing so I don't see how splitting it would help you over time, maintenance would be a pain. With a monolithic package its very minimal to update, R14B took me about an hour to package and push to our yum repo.
>
I don't understand what for to split erlang into many several
subpackages. Who in the hell will ever install only erlang-corba
without, for example, erlang-megaco?
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| Guest |
| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 9:27 pm |
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On Sun, 2010-10-31 at 01:17 +0400, Max Lapshin wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 1:07 AM, Anthony Molinaro
> <anthonym@alumni.caltech.edu> wrote:
> > I think monolithic is the way to go. OTP is released all as one thing so I don't see how splitting it would help you over time, maintenance would be a pain. With a monolithic package its very minimal to update, R14B took me about an hour to package and push to our yum repo.
> >
>
> I don't understand what for to split erlang into many several
> subpackages. Who in the hell will ever install only erlang-corba
> without, for example, erlang-megaco?
It's actually the other way around, why would I have erlang-corba on my
machine if I only run say CouchDB?
Thanks,
vds
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| maxlapshin |
| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 9:29 pm |
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On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 1:23 AM, Vincenzo Di Somma
<vincenzo.di.somma@canonical.com> wrote:
>
> It's actually the other way around, why would I have erlang-corba on my
> machine if I only run say CouchDB?
> Thanks,
> vds
I'm not speaking about "what can be in ideal world". I'm speaking
about: have you ever deselected erlang-corba, when running only
couchdb?
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| Guest |
| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 9:42 pm |
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On Sun, 2010-10-31 at 01:24 +0400, Max Lapshin wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 1:23 AM, Vincenzo Di Somma
> <vincenzo.di.somma@canonical.com> wrote:
> >
> > It's actually the other way around, why would I have erlang-corba on my
> > machine if I only run say CouchDB?
> > Thanks,
> > vds
>
> I'm not speaking about "what can be in ideal world". I'm speaking
> about: have you ever deselected erlang-corba, when running only
> couchdb?
Sorry I am speaking of an ideal world, because I don't see it very far.
In Ubuntu, at the moment we have around 50 packages out of one single
Erlang tarball. If we can only move the effort a bit the from creating
distribution packages to releasing a tarball that can be packaged more
easily, it will pay a lot in the long term.
Thanks,
vds
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| Guest |
| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 10:21 pm |
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On Oct 30, 2010, at 5:24 PM, Max Lapshin <max.lapshin@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 1:23 AM, Vincenzo Di Somma
> <vincenzo.di.somma@canonical.com> wrote:
>>
>> It's actually the other way around, why would I have erlang-corba on my
>> machine if I only run say CouchDB?
>> Thanks,
>> vds
>
> I'm not speaking about "what can be in ideal world". I'm speaking
> about: have you ever deselected erlang-corba, when running only
> couchdb?
Uh, yes. This is not ideal world, this is a real problem that affects end users. Ubuntu includes CouchDB on the livecd, and absolutely does not want all of OTP dragged in as a dependency. Every release there is pressure to remove Erlang and CouchDB to free up more space on the CD. Every few K helps - I want these technologies available in more environments such as mobile and tablet, where space is even more important.
-elliot
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| siv |
| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 10:25 pm |
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This is something like a similar discussion happened in the ruby mailing
list: Debian (and consequently Ubuntu) has the package separation as a
general philosophy, so that each user can install only what it needs. For
example, I installed Erlang in a minimal Debian installation, and I avoided
the all metapackage and installed only the core and some other packages, so
I avoided installing X packages (which are needed by some erlang-*).
So I think we will never see one single package of the whole distribution in
those, at least not officially released.
--
Sivieri Alessandro
alessandro.sivieri@gmail.com
http://www.chimera-bellerofonte.eu/
http://www.poul.org/
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| maxlapshin |
| Posted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 10:29 pm |
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I can understand separation erlang package to erlang-nox, erlang-java
(because it can't be installed on 256MB VPS) and erlang-x11. But I
can't understand any other separation, because I've never heard about
anyone, who _has_ installed only what he wants.
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