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 Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 4:58 pm |
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Hi,
I read Joe Armstrong's PhD thesis. It's a great read for everybody
who's learning Erlang.
One passage that stood out to me was the following:
"In February 1998 Erlang was banned for new product development wit
hin Ericsson - the main reason for the ban was that Ericsson wanted to
be a consumer of software technologies rather than a producer.
In December 1998 Erlang and the OTP libraries were released subject to
an Open Source License. Since that date it has been freely available
for download from http://www.erlang.org/.
In 1998 I left Ericsson together with a number of the original Erlang
group to found a new company Bluetail AB |
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| Guest |
| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 7:44 am |
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Guest
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> What does this mean for Erlang's future?
That was 8 years ago. So more than mean, I would use the word meant. The
"ban" resulted in Erlang being released as open source, with numerous
companies outside Ericsson adopting it and even more looking into it.
(The person responsible to the "Ban" has since been promoted sideways).
DOwnloads of the VM are at an all time high.
> Has Ericsson abandoned Erlang
> development besides periodic maintenance or will Ericsson push Erlang
> in new directions?
Ericsson is using Erlang internally, and quoting others on the list,
like never before.
> Where is Erlang heading?
Proof for Ericsson acceptance is two clicks away from
http://www.ericsson.com, following technology and open source.
Francesco
--
http://www.erlang-consulting.com
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| Guest |
| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 12:50 pm |
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Guest
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On 7/6/06, Francesco Cesarini <francesco@erlang-consulting.com> wrote:
>
> > What does this mean for Erlang's future?
>
> That was 8 years ago. So more than mean, I would use the word meant. The
> "ban" resulted in Erlang being released as open source, with numerous
> companies outside Ericsson adopting it and even more looking into it.
> (The person responsible to the "Ban" has since been promoted sideways).
> DOwnloads of the VM are at an all time high.
>
> > Has Ericsson abandoned Erlang
> > development besides periodic maintenance or will Ericsson push Erlang
> > in new directions?
>
> Ericsson is using Erlang internally, and quoting others on the list,
> like never before.
>
> > Where is Erlang heading?
>
> Proof for Ericsson acceptance is two clicks away from
> http://www.ericsson.com, following technology and open source.
Whew. That's reassuring. It would be a shame if Ericsson truly
abandoned new development with Erlang, both for Erlang developers and
for Ericsson. My confidence in Erlang is now fully regained 
Ericsson has a powerful language on its hands, and a great antidote to
mainstream server languages (Java/C#/PHP). It'll be interesting to see
Erlang challenging those languages in their home court, i.e., web
development.
My 2c.
Thanks for clarifiying!
Best,
Yariv
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| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 8:00 pm |
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Yariv Sadan wrote:
> Whew. That's reassuring. It would be a shame if Ericsson truly
> abandoned new development with Erlang, both for Erlang developers and
> for Ericsson. My confidence in Erlang is now fully regained
Sure, it would suck to lose a bunch of good developers.
However, you have the code. I use Erlang for the productivity it
provides, not because it is "fashionable". If it provides that much
benefit, you can maintain the code yourself.
> Ericsson has a powerful language on its hands, and a great antidote to
> mainstream server languages (Java/C#/PHP). It'll be interesting to see
> Erlang challenging those languages in their home court, i.e., web
> development.
And Ericsson couldn't care less about any of this. Ericsson doesn't
make money on the language. That is, after all, why they open sourced it.
-a
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| joe |
| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 10:42 pm |
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User
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Posts: 93
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Have you ever noted where my email's come from
My thesis was penned in 2003.
Let's write the continuation:
In 2004 I rejoined Ericsson, after 6 years,
working in start-ups and research.
Had things changed? - Yes
Had the ban (which caused us to leave) worked? - No.
"Was Erlang still banned?" - I asked,
"Don't ask, just use it", they said
- o O o -
Once upon a time, when I was a kid, we had
problems.
"Hello Huston we have a problem" - Erlang is banned
Then "problems" became "issues"
<< in about 1999, please, correct me here,
I was gobsmacked - suddenly a perfectly good word
totally vanished from the language - did you ever
hear a politician use the word !"problem" after 1999=? >>
Issues were pretty stable, for several years, but then
suddenly, (two years ago?) "issues" became "challenges"
Challenges were short lived (lasted about a year)
and rapidly became "opportunities"
So we have
problem -> issue
issue -> challenge
challenge -> opportunity
So the problem we had in 1998 is now a wonderful
opportunity "moving forward".
- o O o -
>
> What does this mean for Erlang's future? Has Ericsson
> abandoned Erlang development besides periodic maintenance or
> will Ericsson push Erlang in new directions? Where is Erlang heading?
>
Let's try to answer this:
Ericsson has no corporate policy, regarding Erlang.
Corporate policy is way more abstract than talking about individual
technologies - nobody in above middle management knows how a phone
works.
Policy is all about "providing shareholder value, and moving forward,
etc."
So there is no policy about Erlang.
Where are we heading etc. - silly question - nobody knows.
It's like this:
- We (Ericsson) have a number of products
written in Erlang - these earn stuff called MONEY
- We (and this includes me) are developing
"secret-project-number-1" and "secret-project-number-2" etc.
these we hope will one day earn MONEY
- If
the sum total of MONEY earnt is >> 0
and
we win some internal wars
then
We will do a lot more than periodic maintenance,
and will actively develop and exploit what the
technology
Fi
Now it is my belief that multi-core Erlang etc. will give us
just the edge we need so that our "secret-project-number-1" will
be orders of magnitude faster than other peoples
"secret-project-number-1"
Will this earn money? - who knows?
Will a competitor produce a better product using Haskell, or Java? - who
knows?
Will we win our wars? - who knows?
The only statement I can make is that, I and the other Ericsson
people who post to this list believe in what we are doing - and as
long as they pay our wages and let us work on the stuff we believe in
then we will work to support and improve the system.
I have quit once, and I will quit again if this ceases to be true.
/Joe
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-erlang-questions@erlang.org
> [mailto:owner-erlang-questions@erlang.org] On Behalf Of Yariv Sadan
> Sent: den 5 juli 2006 18:53
> To: Erlang Questions
> Subject: question about Erlang's future
>
> Hi,
>
> I read Joe Armstrong's PhD thesis. It's a great read for
> everybody who's learning Erlang.
>
> One passage that stood out to me was the following:
>
> "In February 1998 Erlang was banned for new product
> development wit hin Ericsson - the main reason for the ban
> was that Ericsson wanted to be a consumer of software
> technologies rather than a producer.
> In December 1998 Erlang and the OTP libraries were released
> subject to an Open Source License. Since that date it has
> been freely available for download from http://www.erlang.org/.
>
> In 1998 I left Ericsson together with a number of the
> original Erlang group to found a new company Bluetail AB-in
> all 15 people left Ericsson. The idea behind Bluet ail was to
> use the Erlang technology to program products which make
> Internet services more reliable. "
>
>
> What does this mean for Erlang's future? Has Ericsson
> abandoned Erlang development besides periodic maintenance or
> will Ericsson push Erlang in new directions? Where is Erlang heading?
>
> Regards,
> Yariv
>
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